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 Medical Care And Medical Choices
Ajamesshaw 35 posts, incept 2011-10-16

Isn't that the infamous toll bridge? bicycles pay what to cross?
Tickerguy 200k posts, incept 2007-06-26

Aj: Zero. Bicycles are free, as are walkers / joggers.

That would be a BRUTAL fucking jog though. The span ITSELF is ~4 miles, so that would be an 8 mile run both ways plus whatever you need to do to get to and from. The round-tripper on the Crap Trap is just over 15 miles, to the Commons and back is about 12-1/2.

It's a nice bike ride but that's a hell of a lot further than I'm willing to run!

"Anyone wearing a mask will be presumed to be intending armed robbery and immediately shot in the face. Govern yourself accordingly."

Jstanley01 8k posts, incept 2008-07-30

Barbell Training is Big Medicine
Jonathon Sullivan MD, PhD

...Aging is characterized by a loss of strength, flexibility, and adaptive physiologic reserve; by senescence of growth and repair systems, blunting of hormonal responses, and atrophy of muscle, nerve, tendon, ligament and bone. This physical atrophy is accompanied by an even more deadly psychological decline. Too often, the aging individual sees that he is getting weaker, and so lowers his expectations and his effortsand thereby grows weaker still. This is analogous to the cell cutting up its own DNA. Once the psyche has surrendered to decline and death, its all over but the suffering.

Like cellular self-destruction, I think human apoptosis also comes in both intrinsic and extrinsic flavors. Fortunately, we have seen a decrease in extrinsic death signaling to older people, with the growing acknowledgment that it is possible to remain fit and active well into our extended life spans. Still, aging individuals are told by cultural stereotypes, TV, family, doctors and other experts that they need to slow down, eat less meat, and for Gods sake act their age. The intrinsic signals are even worse: Im fat. Im weak. Im worthless. My joints ache. And Im too old to do anything about it. Where are the Cheetos?

This is an increasingly prevalent phenotype of aging in America and other industrialized nations [27][28][29] a living hell of progressive weakness, obesity, inactivity, shrinking horizons, sexual impotence, decreased expectations, mounting despair, a growing list of expensive drugs, learned helplessness, sickness, and pain. Its being All Done At Sixtyor Fifty. Its a life of waiting to die from a skin infection or a broken hip or a blot clot, of needing a stupid little fucking go-cart to get from here to there, of not being able to reach your own ass to wipe it, of narcotizing yourself with alcohol, cigarettes, American Idol and Doritos so you dont have to face your own grim existence as a slowly rotting Jabba The Hut. I see it every day. We call it old-itis. A joke, I guess, but an obscene one. This gruesome avatar of aging offends the eye, the mind, and the spirit, and it cries out for both compassion and correction.

Strength training is a macroscopic growth factor, countersignalling all of this evil shit. This is not my wishful extrapolation of cellular phenomena to the human sphere. Its a medical observation, supported by study after study. Research with elderly subjects indicates that resistance training improves overall function and strength [30][31], enhances bone density and balance adaptations [32], and improves the metabolic profiles and glycemic control of patients with type 2 diabetes [33] . A landmark 2008 study of nearly 9000 men followed for an average of nearly nearly 20 years showed that muscular strength is inversely associated with death from all causes, even when adjusting for fitness and cardiovascular health [34].

Thats strength training. What about barbell training? Like every other area of exercise science, research into strength training in the elderly under-represents barbell training. But I would posit that all of the well-known advantages of barbell training will be magnified in elderly populations. The basic barbell exercises train the largest amount of tissue, and will thereby evoke the largest systemic and local responses, including elaboration of trophic factors. Squats, deadlifts, and presses strengthen functional movementsgetting up, walking, standing, bending over, reachingthat we all rely on every day and that can be challenging for deconditioned elderly people. And because, unlike machines, barbell exercises do not isolate joints and their corresponding tendons and ligaments in unnatural loaded movement patterns, we can expect them to be far less likely than machines to damage older, more beat-up joints.

Finally, barbell training, like any other medicine we would give an elderly person, is titratable. In fact, it is far more exquisitely titratable than most medicines. It can be dosed exactly, according to the needs of the patient. But there is one crucial difference here that I must bring to your attention. Unlike other medicines, where an increase in dose corresponds to the patient getting sicker, the 70 year-old patient whose squat prescription goes from 195 to 200 lbs is getting healthier, and stronger.

Thats the kind of prescription Id like to write.

To the Last Rep
In a system (the aging person) whose default mode is to die, whose human apoptotic signaling is in place and activated, barbell training signals for survival and for growth. It forces muscles to grow stronger and more flexible, tendons and ligaments to become thicker, bones to start sopping up calcium and lay down new matrix, kinesthetic perception to get with the program, and endocrine systems to get off their ass. It negates the extrinsic form of human apoptotic signaling: every additional geezer who trains with a barbell is a living refutation of the stereotype of the frail senior, an example of what aging can and should be. More importantly, training blocks the intrinsic form of human apoptotic signaling, by sending a message to the gray goo in our head that yes, we can get stronger...

And before you ask: at present there is absolutely no solid evidence that strength trainingor any other exercise or dietary programwill substantially prolong our life spans. But the preponderance of the scientific evidence, flawed as it is, strongly indicates that we can change the trajectory of decline.

We can recover functional years that would otherwise have been lost. There is much talk in the aging studies community about compression of morbidity, a shortening of the dysfunctional phase of the death process. Instead of slowly getting weaker and sicker and circling the drain in a protracted, painful descent that can take hellish years or even decades, we can squeeze our dying into a tiny sliver of our life cycle. Instead of slowly dwindling into an atrophic puddle of sick fat, our death can be like a failed last rep at the end of a final set of heavy squats. We can remain strong and vital well into our last years, before succumbing rapidly to whatever kills us. Strong to the end.

That, my friends, is Big Medicine...


They assume an authority which is nowhere so dangerous as in the hands of those who have folly and presumption enough to fancy themselves fit to exercise it. --Adam Smith

Coreyh 18 posts, incept 2010-06-10

Dropped over 80 lbs a few years ago doing the same things you are advocating.

It really is very easy once you get over the first week of adjustments.

From what you have written about your journey to lean I think I have a pretty good guess where you're research into the subject has taken you- the Vibrams Five fingers mention solidified it.

My blood work is now perfect, I take no meds and energy levels are higher than ever. Congrats on making it out of "Zombie-land" KD!
Grashopa 3k posts, incept 2009-02-03

Did someone post about the 'wheat belly' here? I love this blog. Heres a good one:

"Your kids are annoying, strung out little junkies that need REAL FOOD. When you come to me about advice about disciplining your out of control kids, what do I advise you to do? Stop feeding them crap! Im sick of hearing that tired line about how exhausted you are and you just dont have time to cook. You forget that I also raised a family while working. You seem to find the time to sit in the drive-thru waiting for your KFC order. How many times to I have to say that Pop Tarts and Pizza Rolls are not food, no matter what the commercials say. Just because you can put it in your mouth and swallow it doesnt make it food."
Analog 1k posts, incept 2010-12-29

"""his theory is that the increase in Alzheimers was the result of using Aluminum cookware (think TV dinners), and that it is now starting to trend downward. I stopped using anti-perspirants with aluminum a few years ago."""

i've always wondered about the sodium alumino- silicate in powdered coffee creamer...... dont use the stuff myself.

Never trust a computer with anything important.
Gantww 1k posts, incept 2011-04-22


Adding that one to my RSS reader. Looks interesting.

Pissing on the host in the middle of the living room with guests present is a pretty good reason for the host to forcibly remove one from the scene, in my humble and correct opinion. - Jack_Crabb
Gantww 1k posts, incept 2011-04-22

One other thing I've started doing (and it borders on foodie-ism) is that I've started making my own sauerkraut and eating a few spoonfuls of it every day. It turned out pretty good once I got comfortable enough to be sure I wasn't going to get botulism or something from it. I can't isolate the probiotic effects from everything else (I threw everything I had at fixing my weight problem, so unfortunately the results are not very useful scientifically).

Another thing I've started doing is being very strict about bed time. By 10:45 central, at the latest, I try to be in bed and reading (winding down for the evening). I remember reading somewhere that lack of sleep would make you crave carbs, although I can't remember whether that was a reputable publication or not. Still, just cutting back on the stuff I do has forced me to focus on the important things and triage the rest. That's how I intend to keep my mind healthy.

And with that, it's 10:30, so I suppose I'll pick up the thread in the morning with the hopes that somebody will know exactly which article I'm referencing in the paragraph above, so I can read it with my brain turned on instead of as an excuse to avoid other things I should be doing.

Pissing on the host in the middle of the living room with guests present is a pretty good reason for the host to forcibly remove one from the scene, in my humble and correct opinion. - Jack_Crabb
Standby 1k posts, incept 2009-08-06

Hey Karl, congratulations!!! You remind me now of my oldest brother who is 62. He's skinny in the hip and waste like that but he's more buff on top only because he's been doing weights for a long time. He's in better shape than a 20 YO and does he get the comments. He lost 'the middle' and he never looked back. Tough to get stress tested on the treadmill because he doesn't 'stress'. So keep it up and enjoy the new you!!! BTW, he only stopped jogging every morning in the last year or two because of the knees and does the stationary instead. It's amazing to be in your shape!!!
Bretondog 43 posts, incept 2011-09-01

FauxFood is killing we Americans.

And anyone else who adopts our diet.

When you get far enough into the research of the pitfalls of the typical American diet, you will discover it is a Corporate Nightmare, a Propaganda filled early-death path and fueled by Television and laziness.

In essence, it is symptomatic of everything that is terribly wrong in this Society.

Many Docs do not know or realize what Karl (and many of us) have discovered.
Look at the FDA's new vegetarian recommendations!
Vegetarianism will fail most people---a few thrive, very few.

There is no doubt that if you cook 90% of your meals from real Food, pastured proteins, real organics, hunted wild game and as natural of a source as possible, (Completely avoiding ANY processed foods and the addictive SUGARs)you can slowly and surely return to a normal weight for yourself.
You can add high quality supplements and reverse/stop Coronary Artery Disease.
Miracles are common.

Cardio range exercise

Turn your back on the typical, average American lifestyle.

Susanjbear 781 posts, incept 2010-06-10

Woo hoo, Karl you did great!

I did the same thing, going through a 75 pound transformation back in 2003-2004.

Fisticuffs 1k posts, incept 2007-07-28

1) If you a serious about developing fitness, have as one of your goals to be able to do a pistol squat. Additionally, in terms of building leg strength, I advocate doing single leg squats with a smith machine. Don't even worry about adding weights to the bar for a while.

2) My preference is to keep fat calories low. 10-20% fat, 20-30% protein, 50-70% carbs. Keeping fat down is easy: avoid oils (whether as a separate food or as part of food such as potato chips or salad dressing) and cream, for meat consume skinless chicken breast and fish. Since you're not pushing ZERO fat you can have a small amount of cheese etc. That pretty much takes care of fat.

3) If you exercise a lot it is important to have carbohydrates. The real culprit as far as carbs go is fructose, whether in HFCS, by itself as fruit juice (vs. eating actual fruit which has fewer fructose calories, has fiber, etc.) or consumption of large amounts of sucrose (which is one part glucose, one part fructose). Physiologically, fructose is metabolized into glucose in the liver, and when the liver has supplied its glucose needs additional fructose is converted into triglycerides (fat, the same fat you'd get if you ate a lot of cheese, butter, red meat, etc.). Because people consume too much fructose they end up with large amounts of triglycerides which are either stored as fat or float in the bloodstream giving you thick, rich barbecue sauce blood (and clogged arteries).

Rentier 197 posts, incept 2010-06-19

Congrats, Karl!

Just curious do you know what your before and after body fat percentages?
Medicdan 10k posts, incept 2010-02-11

Your looking good Karl. Congrats.

Arizona & desert gardening
Drjerry 601 posts, incept 2007-11-06

A while back I laid a motorcycle down. Besides internal injuries, I broke several bones, including both legs. I was still in a wheelchair when I joined this forum. Sitting in that wheelchair, my weight went from 180# to 256# (5'11") Since I have been walking my weight is down to 220# Still way too much but we watch trends. Insurance company is paying for a gym membership. I plan on using it more beginning in the morning. Karl, you are an inspiration And I also noticed the side benefits as my weight came down just a little. I'm 70 BTW
General professional opinion by medical experts was that by now I would be long underground. I fooled 'em.

Karl, I bought a Trek Mountain Bike,what is yours?

Reason: Added more info
Cbxer55 81 posts, incept 2009-07-01

This is what I bought just before Christmas. $1500 bike I got for $799 from Performance Bicycle. Outstanding bike that rides a whole bunch nicer than the ole 1987 Bianchi I used to ride on the street. That Bianchi is now doing permanent duty on a fluid training stand in the garage.
Xanii 117 posts, incept 2011-05-09

Thats me in the first pic. Took down a lot of weight with Atkins in the past.

It all returned back. Why? i didnt do anything about my vices. i.e. late night snacks, energy drinks, soda.

Now it's a new try with a more relaxed diet and it's slowly working. Key is to curb the vices and damn that's hard. Young dont understand how hard it is to bounce back once you go the smoke and drink and get fat road. Age takes it's toll too.
Cvdoc 562 posts, incept 2009-06-11

As a doctor, I give you 5 stars on this post. You make several points eloquently. The money isn't there for us to age and be treated medically as we have. We as individuals need to assume responsibility. Basic laws of physics apply. If you eat less calories, you lose weigh. Some types of food are worse than others.

Few men desire liberty; most men wish only for a just master.
Tm22721 1k posts, incept 2008-01-09

At 5'-10" height, last year I went from 215 to 170 in 6 months. All it took was daily food analysis and exercise. Staying within 1800 cals, 1800 mg sodium. Walking 2 miles in the morning, 12 minutes on a rowing machine every night.

Too much stress destroys discipline. The corporate machine is killing us.

The cheeze in the mouse trap is always free.

Psquared 1k posts, incept 2008-10-11

Congratulations Karl. It feels good to do this and I did it too. In January 2007 I weighed 207 and I am 5'10". My total cholesterol was 447. Over the next 12 months I lost 40 lbs and now weigh between 165-170. I've kept it off for 4 years with no trouble and I did this by diet and exercise.

I don't go to the doctor with every ailment and when I do go I am a careful consumer. I have actinic keratosis from too much sun as a young man. The best treatment I have found is flourouracil which is expensive. I called a few friends and family members got the name of a dermatologist that everyone liked. I called his office and spoke to his nurse. An office visit if I self-paid was $150 plus any treatment. I told her I need a few lesions frozen on my forehead and asked her if the doctor would give me the medicare rate. She said she would check and call me back. She called the next day and said he would see me and do any freezing needed for $130 total.

After the treatment I asked him about alternative treatments. He prescribed his own concoction using flourouracil. (5-FU) The branded cream is about $250 for 4 oz. The way he prescribed it cost me $30. Apparently if a real apothecary will use the ingredient in an off-branded cream it is much less expensive.

So what started as a potential $500 medical bill ended up costing me $160.

I also have periodic backpain - especially if I overdo the exercise. In another day I would have trotted down to the doctor and gotten an X-ray and paid several hundred bucks to be told what I already knew. Take an NSAID, get on a heating pad and take it easy for a few days. I know the difference between serious pain (chronic or acute) caused by joint or bone problems like arthritis and pain caused by a muscle sprain and I am not going to the doctor because my back hurts for a day or two.

I can name other ailments that at one time would have sent me to the doctor but now I treat myself.

colds, flu
Sinus, allergy problems
bowel problems

People have been trained to go to the doctor or the ER for every symptom however slight. If they would just educate themselves on common illnesses and home treatment, and take of their health by getting exercise and eating right we would reduce the demand on the healthcare system. Like everything else if the demand decreases the cost goes down.

That's my take anyway.

"Our Constitution is designed only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for any other." ~ John Adams

Bluebird 2k posts, incept 2008-05-02

Psquared - I wish I had read your post a few months ago concerning the actinic keratosis. Indeed, I just spent $500 for the doctor and Efudex cream. Ugh.

You asked for the Medicare rate, so are you on Medicare?

Or for anyone on Medicare...spouse will turn 65 in March, and we are told we have to sign up for a Medicare drug plan. But we don't take routine prescriptions now, so why spend $30 a month for a plan for drugs that we don't use, or get a plan that we don't know if the drug will be covered if we need a prescription.

Currently, we pay our own medical insurance that does not include prescriptions. So for an occasional prescription, it is paid out-of-pocket.

But if we don't sign up for a Medicare drug plan now, there will be a penalty in the future to get a drug plan.

Anybody else dealing with this Medicare stuff? thanks.

Pay_lay_ale 415 posts, incept 2010-09-16

Karl, I agree with everything you said, but one GLARING omission IMAO is Vitamin D. Unless you work outside in the tropics with little clothing you're not getting enough. Low vitamin D levels are implicated with cardiovascular disease as well as cancer.
Zone5 95 posts, incept 2009-03-07

Another great way to exercise is walking with weight on your back. If you carry a 25 pound golf bag 18 holes (approximately 7 miles) you will burn about 1500 calories and it's easy on your joints.
Wineaux 559 posts, incept 2009-03-23

Congrats Karl. Losing 50lbs is no easy task and you are walking/talking proof that it is possible to achieve without the use of surgery, miracle pills, and miracle diets. You did it all by simply getting off your duff and applying mathematics to your diet.

As someone who has exercised 5 times a week over the past decade +, the key to maintaining a steady fitness routine is to make it a HABIT, much like waking up and brushing your teeth. Convincing oneself that exercise is mandatory and experiencing the transformation of the mind starting to crave it is powerful stuff. More importantly though is your diet and what you CHOOSE to stuff down your pie hole. Success starts and ends with being able to make the difficult decision to stop consuming toxic foods. If you can't get your diet right you're wasting your time, period!! Here too, I've found that changing ones perception of food, works wonders. There was a 3 year stretch in my life where seeing foods such as: Big Macs, french fries, doughnuts, Twinkies, etc... would literally make my stomach turn. It was powerful stuff. My only vice continues to be the wine bottle. Oh well...

Lastly, if you are planning on making jogging a central routine in your exercise profile make sure you get fitted for proper running shoes. Over the past 2 years, I shifted my routine to more outdoor running and as a result of incorrect fitted running shoes (I was running in New Balance that were too narrow), I've developed Morton's Neuroma in both feet. I've recently switched to Brooks wide width and my feet thank me on a daily basis :-). I will also get fitted for a custom orthotic next month.

What wine goes with unemployment?

Gantww 1k posts, incept 2011-04-22

I have the same issue, Wineaux. But I've figured out a trick to that. Make your own wine, and do it using the largest carboy you can find. After a few large batches (and the associated hauling of the carboy up and down stairs to rack the wine off the sediment and whatnot), you'll start to associate the smell of wine with the pain of a backache. You can also control the sugar and alcohol levels of the wine better that way. I didn't do it intentionally, but since making my own wine I consume far less of it (it's more enjoyable when I do, but it has killed off my random consumption). It's also far cheaper, and I can hand it out as Christmas gifts.

Pissing on the host in the middle of the living room with guests present is a pretty good reason for the host to forcibly remove one from the scene, in my humble and correct opinion. - Jack_Crabb
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