America's March Toward Cyprus Status
The Market Ticker ® - Commentary on The Capital Markets
Posted 2013-03-18 08:07
by Karl Denninger
in Editorial
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America's March Toward Cyprus Status
 

It's coming folks.

The sort of disruption you're seeing in Cyprus, with outright confiscation of bank deposits and brokerage accounts, especially retirement assets such as 401ks and IRAs.

Here.

In America.

Within two years.

How do I know?

Because the precedent has already been set, and you, the common American, sat for it.

You allowed the GM bailout to take place where the seniority of bondholders was ignored and they were screwed while the UAW was made whole.

You allowed Obamacare to be passed with the Congress denoting it was a "fine" rather than a Tax, because Congress knew that a direct, unapportioned tax was unconstitutional -- and then you sat again when Judge Roberts of the USSC rewrote Obamacare to be that very same unconstitutional direct Tax.

You allowed John "I'm a traitorous jackass" McCain to suspend his campaign to make sure TARP passed, then you cheered both him and Obama for shoving that piece of crap legislation down Congressional throats, and just two weeks later you returned nearly all of the people who voted for it to office.

You still allow people like John Boehner to make the following sort of statement without showing up outside his office and home and refusing to leave until he resigns in disgrace:

House Speaker John Boehner broke from some Republicans on Sunday when he agreed with President Obama and other Democrats who say the country does not have an immediate debt crisis.

“We do not have an immediate debt crisis,” the Ohio Republican said on ABC’s “This Week.”

In a word, bullcrap.

It's not a crisis when your outstanding debt goes from $6 trillion to $16 trillion in ten years, far more than a double, and what's worse is what is causing the escalation -- medical expense -- and you won't even talk about derailing the policies that you put in place that made this happen?

Like hell.

In two years federal medical spending along with Social Security and interest will, on current paths, reach the total of all tax receipts.

At the outside the market will realize that Congress will never address the underlying issue with medical care because they have steadfastly refused to do so.  At that point we will have become Greece and Cyprus.

For those who say that our banking system is "strong" and "not corrupt unlike Cyprus" may I ask what the record is on money laundering and intentional obfuscation of the truth with regard to firms such as HSBC and Wachovia (both of which were caught laundering enormous amounts of money) and JP Morgan (which was just grilled, along with the regulators, regarding the "London Whale") and not one person or institution has been indicted and prosecuted?

There is about $20 trillion in US Retirement "assets."  A "small" 10% "one time" tax levy on those assets would fund the US Deficit a couple of years from now, and I will go out on a limb now and predict that exactly that will be done.

Of course the "one time" aspect will be a lie too, but you'll lap that one up as well just like you have all the others.

The simple fact of the matter is that the purpose of capital supervision in a banking system is to prevent a degrading banking institution from ever going into negative capital and thus having to hit depositors.  But the record from 2007 to the present is that our banking regulators, including the FDIC, have repeatedly and wantonly failed to follow the law on Prompt Corrective Action which mandates that no bank be allowed to go into a negative capital situation.  Despite this mandate in the law the FDIC has repeatedly, in virtually every case, shown an actual loss when it has closed a bank during these years -- a loss that, if the law is followed, can't happen.

It is simply a matter of time given the endemic corruption and fraud throughout the system before a large institution -- or set of institutions -- is exposed as actually having negative capital and a run occurs which the FDIC and Treasury cannot cover.  This is exactly what happened in Cyprus and it will come here, because you have failed to demand that those who committed these offenses be removed from office when they are politicians and go to prison when they are "connected" business "leaders."

You still tolerate and in fact rally behind people like John "I can't tell the truth" Boehner and Lyin' Ryan, and pack places like CPAC instead of drumming these liars out of the room and demanding that they cut that crap out now or leave office.  And if you're on the left you pay attention to people like Krugman, Pelosi and Bloomberg who continually declare that these fiscal issues -- a matter of arithemetic -- are "phony", instead of de-funding MIT and other places that house folks like Simon Johnson and ejecting from office those on both the left and right who refuse to accede to the reality that 2 + 2 = 4, not 6.

Your money is going to get stolen -- MF Global or Bernie Madoff anyone?

It just takes a keystroke by your government to steal 10% of everything you have in any of your accounts anywhere, and the fact that you have repeatedly failed to stand and demand this crap stop is exactly why it's going to happen not just in Cyprus but right here in America.

Are you awake now?

Oh, and if you're not, this was just said on CNBC:

"This (ed: what Cyprus did) open up enormous possibilities for the Administration"

Yeah, that was tongue-in-cheek -- or was it?

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User Info America's March Toward Cyprus Status in forum [Market-Ticker]
Apotheoun
Posts: 1283
Incept: 2009-08-14
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MN
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**** me. does this mean that after 2 years when everything is completely ****ed and the market tries ramming it up Congress's ass they can do what cyprus is doing to stave it off another year? As much as I hate to say it is our destiny as a country for all this to happen because NO ONE is willing to do a damn thing about it.

After speaking with friends and family I learned we are nothing but a sad minority...

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"when despair is all you can see, the end is finally near."
"Because there is some good left in this world, AND ITS WORTH FIGHTING FOR!"
Apotheoun
Posts: 1283
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Gold
MN
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after reading this I am going to go let off some steam and kick the **** out of the gym.

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"when despair is all you can see, the end is finally near."
"Because there is some good left in this world, AND ITS WORTH FIGHTING FOR!"
Ghopper
Posts: 2317
Incept: 2011-06-11

Staten Island, NY
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By the time the US steals directly from it's own people (it has been massively stealing indirectly) the only ones who will have these accounts are 'millionaires, billionaires, trillionaires and evil speculators'.
That is the way the media will sell it and make Obama out to be a new Robin Hood.
Hogman
Posts: 7874
Incept: 2008-02-18
Green
Derby City, USA
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Thank you sir, may I have another

-Bill
Nevertoolate
Posts: 1219
Incept: 2007-08-26
Gold A True American Patriot!
San Antonio de Bexar de runover with illegals, Texas
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How many politicians in DC are asking themselves this morning, "Gee, why didn't we think of this?"

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"Socialist never mind stealing, as long as they are the ones doing the stealing. They never mind lying, as long as they are doing the lying."-Mannfm11

Before you attempt to beat the odds, be sure that you can survive the odds beating you.
Goforbroke
Posts: 5346
Incept: 2007-11-30
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Just call me 'Comrade'
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And if you try to pull your money out, it will be viewed as "suspicious activity," with attendant consequences.

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We have met the enemy and it is us. -- Pogo

Imajester
Posts: 237
Incept: 2007-08-23
Silver
Dallas, TX
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Folks,

You are not looking at this correctly, they didn't take 10% of your money, it isn't yours after all, they let you keep 90% of the money they allow you to have. When you look at it like that (knowing your place), it doesn’t hurt so much.
Psquared
Posts: 1876
Incept: 2008-10-11

SE USA
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I think they will do it by negative interest rates.

An ongoing, continuous seizure of cash deposits.

They will exempt business accounts.

Thank you Federal Reserve.

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"Our Constitution is designed only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for any other." ~ John Adams
Marketpirate
Posts: 1636
Incept: 2007-11-30
Green
New York
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I guess I should stop making those 3-5 year Lending club loans, I have been investing in to avoid playing in the stock market casino.

In the end, we're all screwed.

smiley



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The bull**** stops when the money runs out, and not a moment before.
Bertdilbert
Posts: 2661
Incept: 2008-12-22
Gold
CA
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Quote:
There is about $20 trillion in US Retirement "assets." A "small" 10% "one time" tax levy on those assets would fund the US Deficit a couple of years from now, and I will go out on a limb now and predict that exactly that will be done.


Yeah but that does not even touch the union pension shortfall that lies ahead Karl so you are going to have to go big. I am sure this tidbit is on Obama's platter this term. Even if they only hit 10%, they will also have to freeze the money so they can smack at it again to get the union pensions shored up.

In addition to a 10% hit, they can likely increase the early withdrawal penalty to say 25% to try and keep your money captive.

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Dear Euroland: Relax, Germany has a plan for your money!

Political Capital Defined: We are out of money but will tax our citizens for whatever it takes to "SAVE" the Euro.
Genesis
Posts: 130747
Incept: 2007-06-26
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I was looking at the 10% as the alleged "one time" to cover the deficit + pension problem for one year.

The BIG problem is that it won't be one time, of course -- that will be a lie. And so-called "deposit insurance" doesn't cover something like this just as it didn't over there.

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I don't care if it makes sense -- only if it makes money. -- Me
Bank (n): See scam, fraud and theft. Eat a bankster -- they're low-carb.
What part of "shall not be infringed" was unclear?
Richardebel
Posts: 96
Incept: 2010-11-15

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If your money is not in a bank, how can they tax it?

Reason: grammer
Docj
Posts: 998
Incept: 2009-09-10
Silver
Duck & Cover
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It's sort of fun to poke my friends who still cling to this silly notion that the GOP is actually some sort of opposition party by quoting their own leadership, such as the latest "wisdom" from Johnny Orange Crush, above - which has the wonderful effect of being 1) entirely wrong and 2) stepping on his own party's alleged message.

When my wife asks why I'm not contributing any money to our retirement funds anymore, all I need to do is point to Cyprus and the Euro-zone - she nods, and we move on.

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The preservation of liberty depends upon the intellectual and moral character of the people. As long as knowledge and virtue are diffused generally among the body of a nation it is impossible they should be enslaved. - John Adams
Ls2gto
Posts: 482
Incept: 2007-08-30
Green
East Coast
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Quote:
The sort of disruption you're seeing in Cyprus, with outright confiscation of bank deposits and brokerage accounts, especially retirement assets such as 401ks and IRAs.


It will be all assets, no special treatment for retirement accounts, we've been warned. Unless it hurts when you drop it on your foot, part of it will be taken for the greater good.
Publius
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Incept: 2009-03-08
Green
Greenville, SC.
Online
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Quote:

If your money is not in a bank, how can the tax it?



Announcement on 6PM News: By Executive Order, in furtherence of the Emergency Banking ****storm Relief Act of 2013(14), all Federal Reserve Notes and other physical currency will be invalid in 2 months. All citizens must turn them into any local bank for conversion to electronic deposits. After 2 months, no such currency will be valid for any purpose.
Bertdilbert
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Yeah but the problem with "one time" is that math will suddenly become important and people will dust off the calculators and plug in the burn rate. That alone will shut down the economy as the "wealth effect" just evaporated.

----------
Dear Euroland: Relax, Germany has a plan for your money!

Political Capital Defined: We are out of money but will tax our citizens for whatever it takes to "SAVE" the Euro.
Seektruth
Posts: 678
Incept: 2007-09-01
Green A True American Patriot!

Online
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This is coming, no doubt...just a matter of time. That said, to me it's like trying to time the stock market. Do you leave your money sitting there, ripe for picking? And hope you get it out in time? Or is now the time to pull it all out, except for maintaining enough in a checking account to pay bills? Or, when it comes to this, does it really matter at that point whether you have your cash or not?
Jata1
Posts: 5064
Incept: 2009-03-08
Green
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"By the time the US steals directly from it's own people (it has been massively stealing indirectly"

You mean like when they steal your wages via taxation and give to Solyndra, Fisker and GM? This is already happening in the US, just under the cloak of taxation.
Kylafoon
Posts: 2458
Incept: 2009-02-05
Gold
Zombie Portal Lookout
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Most folks thought Obama and his wealth redistribution
meant that he would confiscate wealth and give it to
the less fortunate.
It probably never crossed your minds that he would
steal your money for the sake of keeping the rich
oligarchy happy and in power.

Did it?

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"...But whenever we see things done wildly, but taken tamely, then the State is growing insane..." - Gilbert Keith Chesterton 1910

"I found a flaw in the model that I perceived is the critical functioning structure that defines how the world works." - Alan Greenspan, October 2008
Imajester
Posts: 237
Incept: 2007-08-23
Silver
Dallas, TX
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Quote:

If your money is not in a bank, how can they tax it?


devalue it by x%, no difference between funding the government via taxes or funding the government via printing.
Docj
Posts: 998
Incept: 2009-09-10
Silver
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It sort of makes me wonder, bad as this is (and it's pretty freaking awful), what even more awful stuff are TPTB trying to hide by floating this sort of shiny-object trial balloon?

1.5B rounds of ammo to DHS, anyone?

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The preservation of liberty depends upon the intellectual and moral character of the people. As long as knowledge and virtue are diffused generally among the body of a nation it is impossible they should be enslaved. - John Adams
Richardebel
Posts: 96
Incept: 2010-11-15

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"Announcement on 6PM News: By Executive Order, in furtherence of the Emergency Banking ****storm Relief Act of 2013(14), all Federal Reserve Notes and other physical currency will be invalid in 2 months. All citizens must turn them into any local bank for conversion to electronic deposits. After 2 months, no such currency will be valid for any purpose"

The present Fed Notes state "This Note is Legal Tender For All Debts. Public and Private" Is this true or not?

Nevertoolate
Posts: 1219
Incept: 2007-08-26
Gold A True American Patriot!
San Antonio de Bexar de runover with illegals, Texas
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Politicians will NEVER allow outlawing cash. It's their favorite type of bribe!

----------
"Socialist never mind stealing, as long as they are the ones doing the stealing. They never mind lying, as long as they are doing the lying."-Mannfm11

Before you attempt to beat the odds, be sure that you can survive the odds beating you.
Publius
Posts: 860
Incept: 2009-03-08
Green
Greenville, SC.
Online
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It's true now sayeth the law. But the law can be changed tomorrow. The Emergency ****storm Relief Act will do just that. In fact, there might some interpretation of some existing emegency power law that might just allow El Presidente to do it via EO right now, I don't know.
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